Am I reading this correctly?
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| djohnston Sep 24, 2012 11:23 PM EDT |
On his blog, Mark says:Quoting:In summary – please don’t feed the trolls. We’re interested in feedback in what sorts of things would be useful to search straight from the home lens, and how to improve the search results, as well as provide better control of the process to you. Is he saying, "If you want automatic package updates, you must let Amazon handle all your desktop searches and web queries." Or, am I reading it out of context? Quoting:While he admits Ubuntu will make money from searches, he defends it as helping out those that use Amazon to make their lives easier. Well, of course. Ubuntu is a meritocracy! And, Amazon's money has a lot of merit. |
| tracyanne Sep 25, 2012 1:06 AM EDT |
Quoting:Or, am I reading it out of context? yes |
| Steven_Rosenber Sep 25, 2012 1:58 AM EDT |
Any way you slice it, it's ham-fisted. |
| r_a_trip Sep 25, 2012 2:48 AM EDT |
You could also read it as "We need the revenue from Amazon, otherwise there won't be an Ubuntu to update." |
| jdixon Sep 25, 2012 8:36 AM EDT |
I'd say r_a_trip's reading is pretty much on target. Canonical is desperately looking for revenue sources to fund the project so that it can become self sustaining. |
| flufferbeer Sep 25, 2012 3:33 PM EDT |
@r_a_trap and jdixon, I similarly read it as "any measure$$ to $ucker our Baboontu users are appropriate; some measure$$ are more appropriate than others". It's like the old Micro$uck$ is now brought back to life in the body of Mark $huttlewroth! 2c |
| Koriel Sep 25, 2012 4:10 PM EDT |
Ubuntu Unity the 21st century ad-delivery platform will pretty much cover it I believe. |
| tracyanne Sep 25, 2012 6:22 PM EDT |
And yet people here use Android, while complaining about the same sort of thing in Ubuntu. Clearly you are not Ubuntu's target audience. The way people are going on about this, you would think Ubuntu == Linux. |
| notbob Sep 25, 2012 8:28 PM EDT |
Ubuntu has NEVER been about the user being in control. I don't understand why there are any "angry users" at all. The self proclaimed "dictator for life" does what dictators do and ppl are upset? Whatta buncha dolts. ;) |
| tuxchick Sep 25, 2012 9:02 PM EDT |
Quoting: Canonical is desperately looking for revenue sources to fund the project so that it can become self sustaining. And this is surprising? Linux users are quite spoiled by rarely having to buy software. So, as I predicted lo so long ago, that would give more influence and control to advertisers and businesses like IBM and Red Hat. Both contribute substantial funds and personnel to Linux development, and neither one cares about the desktop or mobile devices because they are all about the enterprise server. Google, Amazon, and Facebook rake in the billions and benefit greatly from Linux, but give back only limited bits of code and support, and care nothing for the Linux desktop since they want to stuff everything through a Web browser. Google gives the most, Facebook dribbles out little bits, and Amazon not so much as single one or zero. If users don't want to pay, then you can't blame Canonical for looking for other revenue sources, and you can't expect great advances in desktop applications. We're lucky to have as much good stuff as we do have. |
| Jeff91 Sep 25, 2012 10:04 PM EDT |
The comment about android is spot on. Those getting angry at the Ubuntu folks for trying to turn a profit best not being using android - which google is making cash hand over fist from. |
| slacker_mike Sep 25, 2012 10:43 PM EDT |
@tuxchick, very well said. |
| Koriel Sep 26, 2012 12:04 AM EDT |
As far as im concerned their is a huge difference between marketing and interception of my search data on Android where i pretty much expect it to happen as the norm and therefore I take precautions to prevent the worst of it. I do not expect it to happen on my desktop especially by default, for myself and others thats a step to far. I can easily live without my Android devices but my desktop is almost sacred. At the rate things are going I will be going back to where it all began for me and thats Slackware as i'm reasonably sure their is no way Patrick will hijack my search data. |
| tracyanne Sep 26, 2012 4:00 AM EDT |
It really is no big thing in the general scheme of things Ubuntu, there is already an Amazon lens, all Canonical are doing is integrating it into the home lens on the dash. This provides a service for the people that Canonical are really aiming Ubuntu at, and they aren't the people who are screaming bloody murder. |
| r_a_trip Sep 26, 2012 5:47 AM EDT |
I don't really get the hubbub either. If Amazon in Unity's overview is such a no no, why not just do "sudo apt-get remove unity-lens-shopping --purge"? It's funny. The tune in the FOSS world always was that the software is free and that the money was in services. Canonical just added a money making service and it is hailed as the end of the world. As for privacy. If you want to use this to get Amazon "recommendations", then Amazon wil get your search query. If you don't want that, just disable the software facilitating the unwanted behaviour. |
| jdixon Sep 26, 2012 5:52 AM EDT |
> And this is surprising? Not particularly, no. > This provides a service for the people that Canonical are really aiming Ubuntu at, and they aren't the people who are screaming bloody murder. Come on it, the water's fine. :) Seriously, as I've noted before, it always seems to come back to Slackware or Debian. > This provides a service for the people that Canonical are really aiming Ubuntu at, and they aren't the people who are screaming bloody murder. Exactly. Canonical is no longer interested in the traditional desktop market. Anyone who hasn't figured that out by now hasn't been paying attention. Which is their choice to make. Anyone Ubuntu user who wants a traditional desktop should probably be looking for another distribution to use. |
| slacker_mike Sep 26, 2012 7:35 AM EDT |
@jdixon while you might be right that Canonical isn't interested in the "traditional" desktop they are very much focused on the Linux desktop. |
| CFWhitman Sep 26, 2012 9:03 AM EDT |
If someone really doesn't like it, then they should realize that you don't need to run it. You don't even need to run Ubuntu to get Ubuntu; that is, you don't need to run Ubuntu proper to take advantage of the Ubuntu software repositories; there are plenty of Ubuntu spin-offs available. |
| jdixon Sep 26, 2012 9:59 AM EDT |
> ...that is, you don't need to run Ubuntu proper to take advantage of the Ubuntu software repositories; there are plenty of Ubuntu spin-offs available. Or you can just run Debian, and avoid the spin-off matter entirely. |
| notbob Sep 26, 2012 12:29 PM EDT |
> Linux users are quite spoiled.... > We're lucky to have.... Whoa, whoa, WHOA! I don't recall DEMANDING Linus give me an OS or that volunteers deliver unto me. Seems to me the linux community has been quite outspoken about embracing what if offers. Fine. It was gifted and I accepted. End of obligation! I've done my part. I've preached the party line, hosannaed it's merits. I've worked d@mn hard to learn how it works, learn how to drive, not merely hop on board for the ride. I'll even pull chauffeur duty. Plus, I pay my way. Lacking developer skills, I subscribe to and patronize my preferred distro and donate, when possible, to developers I want to succeed and continue. No bitching and kvetching, here. They may charge. Fine by me. I don't have to buy. Likewise, if they don't like it, they don't have to develop. But, don't tell me I should be grateful and imply I'm spoiled. No one is putting a gun to the head of linux developers. They can quit any time, jes like me. |
| CFWhitman Sep 26, 2012 12:47 PM EDT |
Quoting:Or you can just run Debian, and avoid the spin-off matter entirely.Yes, I intended to cover that with the statement, "you don't need to run it," though that could be taken to mean the lens (I actually meant both, you don't need to run the lens, and, you don't need to run Ubuntu). Although while we're on the subject, Debian is a nice distribution, though some may find it too stable for their taste. Of course, there are other ways to get a more up to date version of Debian, like Linux Mint Debian Edition, Aptosid, or Siduction (I'm sure there are others). I myself have the Crunchbang backport edition running on a netbook. These are all slightly geekier than Ubuntu respins in some way or another, though, and some may find them intimidating. |
| tuxchick Sep 26, 2012 12:52 PM EDT |
notbob, nobody told you should be grateful. Anyway it's quite clear nobody can ever tell you anything. "The one that pays the piper calls the tune." It's just as true for Linux and FOSS as everything else in life. Linux is extremely strong and dominant on the server because that's where the money is. Linux server development is driven by big business, because big business has poured literally billions of dollars into it. It's less strong on the desktop because that is where the money isn't. (Due in large part to the unholy influence of Microsoft, and now Apple striving to be the biggest bully.) If users don't want to pay money to support Ubuntu, and advertisers do, then advertisers will drive Ubuntu development. Just like advertisers control television, radio, sports, and most of online publishing. We don't see all those zillions of inane cloud stories because readers want them. It's never been a secret that Canonical wants to be a for-profit venture. Back in the beginning when Ubuntu was all new and fresh, a whole lot of Linux users were very happy to have a rich sugar daddy swoop in and spend his fortune creating and supporting Ubuntu. Such short memories... |
| notbob Sep 26, 2012 1:57 PM EDT |
> nobody can ever tell you anything. Since when has that ever been an impediment? ;) > nobody told you should be grateful.... >> We're lucky to have..... My bad. I didn't realize you were actually prognosticating my fortunes at the gaming tables. ;) FWIW, I am extremely grateful and have no problem with Ubumtu or RH or anyone else making a bundle off linux or their being the carrot on the stick. More power to 'em. Likewise, I'm not "spoiled" nor am I "lucky" to be the beneficiary. There is no luck involved, here, only conscious choices. Developers choose to develop. I choose to adopt. Developers have no obligation to provide nor I to be grateful. Such is the nature of choice, what linux is allegedly all about and what many folks choose to forget/ignore. |
| r_a_trip Sep 27, 2012 3:35 AM EDT |
Beware of the people who trot out "You got it for free, you should be grateful." Not saying this is the case in this thread, but this line of argument is often used in our fine community to deflect criticism on projects. |
| jdixon Sep 27, 2012 10:55 AM EDT |
> Beware of the people who trot out "You got it for free, you should be grateful." As I said earlier: You don't look a gift horse in the mouth, but if it insists on biting you, you don't keep it in your barn either. |
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