KMail
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| Ridcully Jan 06, 2012 6:28 AM EDT |
In KDE4.4 and also in KDE4.5, KMail worked brilliantly. It was just the same as normal KMail in every version of KDE from KDE3.4. The mail folder was stored in .kde or .kde4 and you just looked in /kde4/share/apps/ and then looked for kmail.........and there were all the mail folders. If you were totally upgrading, you just copied them into the new version from the old version, updated the permissions and away you went. Now we come to the version of KMail in openSUSE 12.1, which I believe is KDE4.7 Suddenly, setting up your account does not have a single item in it, there are three which includes the mail account, an Akonadi server and "summat else". What the heck does each of these ghastly things do ? The mail folder cannot be easily copied across because it doesn't exist any more. KMail2 is the new folder and it seems to be ignored by the KMail program. Oh, and you can import old KMail as long as they are a single file......for heaven's sake, the KMail email files are dozens of folders and hundreds of individual files and the old KMail programs have NO EXPORT FUNCTION.......Or that is now how I see it. Who engineered this abomination ? It is confusing, inoperative, and absolutely bl888dy useless. Of course, the problem may be me......but why, why, why is KDE suddenly dumping standard procedures, structures and protocols in a highly important piece of software ? I am sick and tired of innovation for innovation's sake because that is what this appears to be. There........I've had my rant.......And now everybody can show me how wrong I was and why KMail in its latest iteration is the answer to a maiden's prayer.......but so far (and Lordy knows I have TRIED !!!) I cannot get KMail in open SUSE 12.1 to work in any way other than I got it to send and receive a test email........but pick up the earlier emails from my previous installations.........NEVER !!!!!! |
| jacog Jan 06, 2012 6:56 AM EDT |
Your rant is justified, but I suggest ranting at the KDE devs instead. Cuz doing it here is also bleighteighteightdy useless. :P |
| jdixon Jan 06, 2012 7:46 AM EDT |
> ...but I suggest ranting at the KDE devs instead. Cuz doing it here is also bleighteighteightdy useless. :P He'll just be considered a "toxic user", jacog. |
| jacog Jan 06, 2012 7:57 AM EDT |
Then wording his grievances in a polite and well-structured manner is likely a better approach. So I take back what I said originally - by all means rant here :) but definitely do raise it with the devs, or if there's a discussion on it already, chime in. |
| Fettoosh Jan 06, 2012 1:42 PM EDT |
@Ridcully, Sorry I wasn't the first one to agree with you :), and I totally agree that the KDE devs really messed up KMail big time. There are many unhappy users who already complained about showed their dismay on the KDE sites. Fortunately for me, I stopped using it long time ago. |
| dinotrac Jan 06, 2012 4:48 PM EDT |
Quoting:KDE devs really messed up In other news, the sun rose in the east, dogs barked, and fish swam. We will keep you apprised of these shocking developments. |
| Ridcully Jan 06, 2012 5:21 PM EDT |
@Jacog.......yes, and point taken loud and clear, but Jdixon has also nailed the point as well. I didn't know how badly KMail was being described in the KDE blogs and I needed somewhere to get it off my chest. The nice thing about LXer is that people DO actually read, digest and comment on what you say and nine times out of ten you get useful feedback on how to solve problems. My use of the great Australian adjective was appropriate to the "polite level of frustration" I had reached. Thankyou Fettoosh.....I am pleased I am not the only one. The problem is that KMail for me has always been a pleasure to use, simple to set up, effective in its operation, did everything I wanted and "just worked". Exactly like Linux software almost always does. Why in heaven's name the KMail developers decided to just "snap" things as they did in KDE4.7 beats me. Assuming you have some leverage, this is a very strong and pleading cry to the KMail developers: Please put in a user switch which will allow classic KMail to be used, OR, this other "thing" to be used depending upon your mental stability and willingness to persevere in the face of impossible odds..... Please KMail team: Give the choice of operation back to the user. |
| Fettoosh Jan 06, 2012 6:40 PM EDT |
Quoting:Assuming you have some leverage, ... I wish I did and many of the things that happened during the KDE 4 development wouldn't have happened. :-). Just recently I created an account to submit bug reports. One of them was Tracyanne's issue with Dolphin auto-sizing icon, which I found out many others complained about. I know the KDE team can't listen to every user's complain, no group of developers can. Whether they have such a thing or not, what I would have done is select a number of designated users, not developers, to form "advisory committees/groups" just to advise on the planing and give feedback on many of the issues users encounter. This isn't an easy thing to do but worth trying. KDE is getting pretty big and complex and could use some outside opinion. One of the main issues is the level of integration of multiple KDE UI and the numerous applications running on them. Add to that compatibility with Gnome interfaces. I am not sure the developers can continue handling all these efforts in a effective and smooth fashion. In terms of KMail issue, I am sure they will fix it since they have been working on it for a while. |
| caitlyn Jan 06, 2012 8:51 PM EDT |
You know what makes the KDE developers look good in spite of everything you guys have written? The GNOME developers. |
| Ridcully Jan 06, 2012 10:25 PM EDT |
Thanks Fettoosh.....Given that KMail is certainly a critical component, I am sure it will be fixed, but in its present state it should never have seen the light of day in a crucial update to KDE4. In its own way, this is as bad as KDE4.0 . For me, all I did was try to use the latest openSUSE 12.1 with the latest KDE version - with the inevitable follow-on results. I won't be touching openSUSE 12.1 or the next interation until KMail is usable, simply because I require it absolutely. Even though it will no longer be supported in about 10 days, openSUSE 11.3 with KDE4.4 is so stable and works so well, I shall stay on it as long as I can for up to a year or even more - but continue to experiment with the next version of KDE4, because 4.7 for me is unusable. Without wishing to give any offence, and I hope none taken, your comment directly above has strongly implied something about KDE4 that I have stated previously and continue to believe: KDE4 has become overcomplex and dare I say, bloated. And it is the only DE in which I am comfortable. It's why I believe that KDE4 should offer users an easy way of transforming the DE into a simple, traditional DE.....yeah, I know, like the KDE3.5 DE used to operate. But this situation is also why there is such interest in the development of the Trinity DE and I see that software becoming a serious alternative for the disgruntled KDE4 user. Add Caitlyn's caustic comment about the Gnome developers and what I understand is their removal of a traditional, controllable, simple Gnome DE and you begin to ask yourself: WHY ? Why are the developers ignoring the wishes of the users ? I have no answer other than the very cynical phrase that "developers need to develop, not bugfix." And I am sure that's wrong......isn't it ? Or isn't it ? Edited comment: LOL......Please note, that I do not in my second paragraph wish to imply I am overcomplex and bloated. I meant that KDE has always been my DE and I have no wish to change as it satisfies my computing requirements perfectly.......... :-) |
| dinotrac Jan 06, 2012 11:27 PM EDT |
@ridcully -- Many things are in the eye of the beholder, but have you presented any clear evidence that you are not, in fact, overcomplex and bloated? I thought not. |
| Ridcully Jan 06, 2012 11:34 PM EDT |
@dinotrac...........I absolutely, hand on heart, bible, whatever you like, swear this is true.....The instant after I logged out when I had put that edited comment in........I said to myself that knew I had left myself open to dinotrac...but decided against reopening. Does this help ? My local GP says I have lost weight and my bp is 110/70......he says I am subnormal, but then he's biased. LOL |
| tuxchick Jan 06, 2012 11:45 PM EDT |
LOL Caitlyn! I knew there was a good reason to drop in tonight :) |
| dinotrac Jan 06, 2012 11:52 PM EDT |
@Ridcully.... Well OK then, but never admit to subnormal. Just tell folks you've replaced the iron in your hemoglobin with titanium. |
| Ridcully Jan 07, 2012 12:10 AM EDT |
@Dinotrac......Okay then......just call me the "man of steel", with those sort of red corpsuckles, I must be......Would it be better for your thoughts if I told you that a yet to be received Christmas gift is a book called "Rumpole's Christmas Stories" ? The crusty old blighter really appeals to me. Probably we're kindred spirits.....scotch, gin, brandy, port........ |
| Khamul Jan 07, 2012 12:49 AM EDT |
ridcully wrote:Why are the developers ignoring the wishes of the users ? Why should they care about the wishes of the dumb users? They are developers! They know what's best for you! You need to bow down to them and worship them and accept whatever they give you without question or complaint. How dare you, a lowly user, question a developer. |
| tracyanne Jan 07, 2012 12:57 AM EDT |
Quoting:You know what makes the KDE developers look good in spite of everything you guys have written? The GNOME developers. Indeed, especially when you consider the sneaky underhand way in which they are attempting to make GNOME Panel irrelevent. The KDE developers are the paragon of virtue compare to that. |
| dinotrac Jan 07, 2012 6:26 AM EDT |
@ridcully -- Rumpole? I Bailey knew the guy. |
| dinotrac Jan 07, 2012 6:27 AM EDT |
@ta -- And software is one game where a paragon beats a can't see straight. |
| Ridcully Jan 07, 2012 8:48 AM EDT |
@dinotrac.......You can't kid me - you knew him well Horatio; I have it on the direct authority of "she who must be obeyed". |
| Fettoosh Jan 07, 2012 1:24 PM EDT |
Quoting:Without wishing to give any offence, and I hope none taken, your comment directly above has strongly implied something about KDE4 that I have stated previously and continue to believe: KDE4 has become overcomplex and dare I say, bloated. @Ridcully, Same here and as I recall, I didn't disagree with you about the complexity, what I disagreed with is the dumbing down of KDE In regards to UI integration complexity, I think so far they have done relatively well. What I am concerned about is making all their applications work on all UI Workspaces and all their applications integrated with the Symantec Desktop Search they have been working on for a while. That is not a small nut to crack and is taking a toll on their development efforts. PIMS in general and KMail in particular are couple examples of the victims. Again, they should have kept KDE 3.x KMail the same and started a new KMail version as a separate new application for that purpose. they have done that with Kongueror/Dolphin and they are doing that with Kopete. In hindsight, it would have been a better approach for the whole KDE 4 development process, but I am not sure it would have been possible considering the scale of the whole effort and the limited resources they had. That is what I always said that Gnome devs. should have followed in the development of Gnome 3. |
| dinotrac Jan 07, 2012 1:53 PM EDT |
@rc -- So long as you're not married to the idea. |
| Fettoosh Jan 07, 2012 2:21 PM EDT |
@Ridcully, It might be informative and helpful to read some of the KDE News especially here Do a search for KMail and read some of the user complains & suggestions. Most recent I read today Get Involved Contribute/Bugsquad |
| Ridcully Jan 07, 2012 6:38 PM EDT |
@Fettoosh.....thanks. I had a look at all three, but the first is the only one that deals with any problems with KMail. I have seen others which suggested that you remove the KMail in the latest versions and replace it with the KMail of the earlier versions and as a test run, I tried it but ended up with so many conflicts of libraries and an unworkable KMail that I scrapped that idea. I am not quite sure what I will do about this matter, other than rejecting KMail outright and transferring to another email client that remains more or less the same...or even giving the whole thing the flick and moving to GMail........ @dinotrac......Perish the thought.....never !!!!!!!! Hilda was never more than a passing acquaintance; terrifying lady, Brunnehilde had nothing on her. |
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