I take exception.....immediately
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| Ridcully Mar 29, 2011 6:56 AM EDT |
First, this article puts OpenOffice in as the Office suite......Surely the writer is aware of the fact that in the FOSS world, Libre Office has superseded OpenOffice and indeed will be the default office suite in future releases of Ubuntu. Second, why Chrome when FireFox comes automatically in Ubuntu (as far as I know, because I don't use Ubuntu) as the default browser ? Moreover, FireFox is in practical terms as fast and useful as Chrome - or at least that's my perceptions. I used Chrome for a short period, found no useful advantages and kicked it off my system. Third, I'd also love to know why Ubuntu was automatically selected instead of Fedora, openSUSE, Mandriva, etc. At the desktop level, the students won't be worried at all about which one of the various distros is being used, and from my own perspective, openSUSE is remarkably stable and is used as the basis for SLED which is Novell's commercial platform. I find the writer's reasons that Linux Mint is too close to Windows a bit silly. If the children are familiar with Windows, surely it makes sense to use a distro that comes close to what they are familiar with ? I am an ex-high school teacher and believe me, I am aware of the need to take one step at a time so that there is always one foot in the known, while the other is feeling for the unknown. Finally, by selecting "Ubuntu" is the writer automatically selecting Gnome as the DE ? And if so, why not KDE ? It's an important choice and nothing is mentioned. In addition, KDE is often quoted as the Linux DE that most closely resembles the Windows DE.......again, a familiar environment is very useful when moving into the unknown of Linux. Just some immediate thoughts. |
| helios Mar 29, 2011 9:23 AM EDT |
I once exhibited the idealism of the author. It died a quick, ugly death...the dawn of reality broke and illuminated some ugly truths about most US school systems and their slave/master relationship with Microsoft. No matter what "advantages" Linux may provide as an inexpensive alternative, regardless of the steady drum beat of the "Free Software" philosophy, we've found that one thing and one thing only stands in the way of Linux adaptation in US Schools. As long as there is a MCSE IT manager, there will be no migration to Linux on any meaningful level. School administrators allow these people to set up their little IT fiefdom and any tech matters are referred to them with their word being the last. The LAST thing a person with a Doctorate in Eduction wants is to be sucked into any tech issue. Seen it first hand on a grand scale. With our local district facing over 500 teacher layoffs, they still want to treat software as a budget line item and they obey every command to upgrade. My sources inside this district tell me that they are doing computer refreshes as often as every two years, and each refresh contains the latest and greatest MS OS. Pardon my cynicism, but I've sat in a Prinipal's office and watched a MCSE IT Director tell her that it was illegal to remove Windows from any of the school's computers and he then excused himself from the room. You cannot fight that. Sure there is the "Indiana phenomenon", but outside of that, Windows will remain the tech teacher that creates mouse clickers and not computer users. |
| JaseP Mar 29, 2011 10:33 AM EDT |
Amen, Ken. The way to sell Linux to Schools?!?! ... Have an insider in the district's administration. |
| Ridcully Mar 29, 2011 3:06 PM EDT |
Ken and JaseP.....yes, fully agree..But there is another aspect that continues to "niggle" at my perception of the "Linux in Schools" problem. Ultimately, I think that the contents of the school curricula are driven by the needs of the school product users, ie. the employers. If business begins to demand that employees have some knowledge of Linux, I think schools will be forced to accomodate this need. And there is slow but general acceptance of the security, stability and low cost of Linux in the business server area. Also, you need only to think of the New York and London stock exchanges to see how the world of commerce is slowly switching to Linux. The LSE move to reject the much slower and unstable Win platform and replace it with a Linux based platform was so important that there were even hints of some type of sabotage to force a return to Windows when some major glitches during in the swap-over. I can't remember the figures but the use of Linux dramatically increased the rate of transactions of the LSE and other stock exchanges will have to follow if they wish to remain competitive. There are lots of straws in the wind that suggest that such a business need is being slowly established. Things like internet servers, Android, HP and WebOS, embedded systems on tv's/videoplayers etc. We often tend to think only in terms of the baseline computer desktop running Fedora, openSUSE, Ubuntu or "summat", and even there huge advances are being made: for instance in the French police, Brazil, S Africa and others too numerous to mention. There's also other noises being made like the recent move by the UK govt. to insist that FOSS software must now be considered fully in software tenders for govt. use; and of course, Putin has now mandated that Russia is to move completely to Linux - that will be one to watch. Each of these is a tiny step true, but they are steps forward even if it so blankety blank frustratingly slow, but the demand for Linux trainees will increase steadily, and ultimately it has to affect the school curricula. Part of the problem is that educational curricula developers are notoriously conservative and they are Microsoft trained. It is an enormous blockage in the system. I think the final proof that FOSS/Linux is slowly winning the war is that Microsoft seems to be establishing new income policies: litigation and royalties. Just in case the use of WinOS and Office diminish. I also note a side news item on Groklaw in that Microsoft is actually "trying on" a situation somewhere round the world in which they are saying that it is a sort of piracy if only Linux is installed on a computer without a licence and if their software is pre-installed then there will be licence. Right - confused ? So am I, but it actually happened. The unilateral steps by HP to include WebOS on all HP computers is a classic instance of how a big company is beginning to view Microsoft absolute dominance as an encumbrance not a plus. Oh look......I don't think Linux in schools will suddenly and dramatically happen for most cases, but if you marvellous people don't continue to erode Microsoft's dominance and put Linux in front of young people, it never will. And Linux will come to the desktop, of that I am convinced, even if Australian governments remain followers and keep their heads firmly............ummmm.......in the sand. What eventually reaches the school desktops may be called by any name other than Linux (I mean to say, Linux is so hard to use and only meant for geeks), but Android is proving conclusively that anyone can use Linux.....And smartphones reach most of the youngsters today. I remain quietly confident !!!!!!!!! |
| gus3 Mar 29, 2011 3:21 PM EDT |
@Ridcully: 5 paragraphs may be "confident," but "quietly"? LOL |
| Ridcully Mar 29, 2011 4:40 PM EDT |
Hi Gus3......and I'm laughing as well...... :-) Trust you to think laterally - and this is why I love LXer so much. It's just that I couldn't sleep and it was about 4.30am with a cup of tea that I sat down to try to put my thoughts in order, and various aspects came flooding in......sigh.....couldn't help myself......But I do remain "quietly confident" that Linux will ultimately win. |
| skelband Mar 30, 2011 2:43 PM EDT |
Part of the answer to this to attack the core applications.
When your core applications are tied to the OS, then the OS is a given. Moving to LibreOffice and other tools rather than defaulting to the MS software option is the biggest issue. Break that lock in, then the platform becomes far less of an issue. I'm hoping that the LibreOffice initiative will breath new life into the dodgy interface that LibreOffice/OpenOffice currently has, which I believe is one of the biggest issues at the moment. Trying to find a setting or option in the Options area is a bit of a lottery at the moment. That whole area needs to be redesigned from scratch. Only then, will people be more willing to go that route. |
| Bob_Robertson Mar 30, 2011 6:38 PM EDT |
Skelband, I agree. Just getting F/OSS applications into an enterprise, ANY enterprise, is critical. Any school that requires Microsoft Office to be used by students at home is one that should be targetted INSTANTLY with LibreOffice, at least. |
| hkwint Mar 30, 2011 6:45 PM EDT |
Ridcully: So I'm not the only person deprived of sleep because LXer is so great! Glad to know I'm not alone. |
| JaseP Mar 31, 2011 9:34 AM EDT |
Quoting: Any school that requires Microsoft Office to be used by students at home is one that should be targeted INSTANTLY with LibreOffice, at least. With a step-son in Kindergarten [he] a daughter who's a preschooler, I'll pitch a fit in a few years if their homework assignments are required to be on M$ (or Apple) stuff,... when they're old enough, that is. I have already taught my stepson the phrase, "Micro$oft sucks!" He knows what Linux is (maybe doesn't fully understand it, yet) & my daughter will, too. And they both see what it can do[/he] multimedia, home automation/security, & (relatively) soon, telephony, followed by family scheduling, etc... They'll be nobody in their pool of friends who will believe FOSS limits you. |
| pogson Apr 03, 2011 8:59 AM EDT |
I have been working in schools in the north of Canada for the last 14 years. Most of them do not even have an IT department except the computer teacher. That makes a much more fertile ground for GNU/Linux. The last place where I worked had only half its XP machines running when I arrived. When I left it had twice as many PCs and 95% of them ran GNU/Linux. These were all machines that would have been pitiful with 7 and were sad with XP. Selling points for GNU/Linux in schools: 1)New software without having to upgrade hardware. Using old machines as X-terminals works. They get better than new performance from a new GNU/Linux terminal server with the big files cached and RAID/huge RAM. 2)Local services - WordPress, PHPbb, Wikimedia, Gallery, etc are all excellent for what schools do. It is much more efficient for schools to build local content than to buy it or have each teacher buying separately. Students can grow with their content from Early Years to graduation. The information contributed by teachers and staff accumulates and remains useful instead of filling filing boxes. Content is SAFEr than random stuff from the web. Search with Swish-e or Google Desktop are wonderful tools to combine with all the content hundreds of students, teachers, cameras and scanners can contribute. 3)No slowing down, malware, re-re-reboots, etc. In the last school, not a single teacher or student preferred "7" although many accepted XP as "normal". That changed when they saw the snap of GNU/Linux on the same hardware. 2X faster boots. 5X faster logins. 4)The flexibility of sending software home, cloning systems, or installing new applications instantly from a huge repository like Debian's is appealing to schools who normally have to go under the "petty cash" radar or through a multi-year proposal, budget, purchase order process. With GNU/Linux one can identify a package and install it on most systems without a reboot or licensing or budgetary issues. The big school divisions do have a weakness, their budgets. Invariably will come budget-crunches. That is the best time to ask that a division should migrate to FLOSS, to keep older hardware running like new or better on FLOSS. 90%+ of their budgets go to teachers' salaries. In a crunch there usually is no alternative but to cut teachers. It is hardest to justify shipping big bucks to M$ at a time like that. The usual response of IT is to freeze new acquisitions. The choice of getting better than new performance from older hardware instead of the steady deterioration of XP is powerful. The way around IT blockage is either through grassroots/taxpayers' revolt or getting the attention of board members who are elected and are supposed to be responsive to taxpayers. Demanding the amount going to non-free software licences be a line-item is a good first step. Assuming that other OS is free has to go. They cannot pinch pennies on other line-items and ignore licensing. Another approach is to insist on competitive bidding on services rather than particular products. ie. budget/procure personal computers systems rather than "7" PCs. Even then M$ will provide school divisions considering GNU/Linux free licences (see EDGI). Respond with all software included with GNU/Linux, particularly on servers of which M$ has little to offer and side by side performance tests. FLOSS can win on flexibility and performance. |
| helios Apr 03, 2011 9:39 AM EDT |
The way around IT blockage is either through grassroots/taxpayers' revolt or getting the attention of board members who are elected and are supposed to be responsive to taxpayers. On it's face, this seems like the logical avenue of approach. We did this in 2008. We attended board meetings and parent/teacher meetings all across our city. Sure, there was plenty of interest from the taxpayers and some outrage, but the vendor agreements the schools sign with Microsoft and other software companies explicitly state that there will be no disclosure of information pertaining to what they pay to software vendors. If we cannot produce the numbers, we cannot proceed. Even evoking the Freedom of Information Act of 1974 is impotent...the agreements supersede the law it seems. Microsoft has build themselves a stable cash machine within our schools and have hired the best lawyers they can to protect it. |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 03, 2011 5:27 PM EDT |
> Microsoft has build themselves a stable cash machine within our schools and have hired the best lawyers they can to protect it. What's funny is that anyone can act surprised that I'm an anarchist. |
| steever Apr 03, 2011 11:23 PM EDT |
I was a network administrator with an international school in Japan. In 2003 when I started the school lab was made up of 30 windows 95 machines. It was "this one prints but has no Internet", "this one doesn't have office but you can print", and so on. All connected to a Windows NT 4 server. I used K12LTSP (an LTSP distro built for schools) and things were good for a year because suddenly the network was reliable and all the computers worked and were the same. At the end of the year the school suddenly had some money for computer purchases. I was happy as I would to buy some PCs to put Fedora on (Ubuntu was only a sparkle in Shuttleworth's eye at this time), and upgrade the network . But the school said, "now that we've got some money, let's get XP and Office". Investigating the situation, I found out that while the kids were happy with Linux, staff were "more comfortable with microsoft". So we used Windows XP with Office 2003 and anti-virus. Cost a lot of money, but people were comfortable. I used a Linux server, however, so the server-side was pretty easy and carefree. That's the main objection: teachers who don't have the inclination (or time) to learn something new, not always network administrators. |
| helios Apr 04, 2011 10:32 AM EDT |
@ Stever, That is true...I've always asserted that the genius of Bill Gates wasn't in the code but his understanding of human behavior. He only had to be a monopolist long enough to set that behavior. He knew full well that he would be fined millions...but he gained billions. I'll let you call me a monopolist or pretty much whatever label you want to tag me with for that kind of money. |
| Fettoosh Apr 04, 2011 12:49 PM EDT |
Quoting:I'll let you call me a monopolist or pretty much whatever label you want to tag me with for that kind of money Any one would, worst yet, most people would do absolutely anything for money these days. Isn't this how corporations are ruling the world! Money Makes the World Go Round http://www.aimwell.org/Books/Pesala/Money/money.html |
| skelband Apr 04, 2011 12:59 PM EDT |
@steever That just blows my mind. What are those people thinking? The trouble is, I could see exactly the same think happening at our kids' school. One the one hand, they could get extra PCs and infrastructure, perhaps everyone could get a PC each. On the other, let's just replace something that costs us nothing with something that costs us money and end up no better that where we started. I think people with this attitude should be made to spend their own money on "convenience" changes. Let's see how keen they are then. |
| helios Apr 04, 2011 5:22 PM EDT |
I think people with this attitude should be made to spend their own money on "convenience" changes. Let's see how keen they are then. And that's the kind of thinking that makes the LXer forums a smart place to be. +1 skelband |
| skelband Apr 04, 2011 8:20 PM EDT |
@steever: another thought After a year of using Linux and presumably some open source tools, what about the "cost and effort" of moving all those kids to a new Environment? You say that the kids were happy with their old environment? =================== Student: Miss! How do I open my openoffice project file that I started last week? Teacher: Just use the new shiny, bright spanking new Microsoft Office. It will work just fine. Student: I tried that, but it doesn't work. It says it doesn't recognise the format. Teacher: Well, install OpenOffice for Windows, load it up, save it as a .doc format then open Microsoft Office, load it up and it will work just fine. Student: Well I tried that as well, and all the formatting is wrong. Couldn't we just use OpenOffice like we did before, miss? Teacher: No, definitely not. If we did that, people would ask why we spent all that money on Microsoft Office and we must justify the expenditure. Student: Errrr, that's silly. Teacher: Yes, you are right. But I don't make the rules. Some parents on the IT committee made the decision and we have to stick with it, so get on with it. ========================= He-he |
| JaseP Apr 05, 2011 9:30 AM EDT |
Yep. Expenditure Justification... It's one of the many "Dilbertisms" you find in the corporate world, too. |
| jsusanka Apr 05, 2011 6:56 PM EDT |
"Pardon my cynicism, but I've sat in a Prinipal's office and watched a MCSE IT Director tell her that it was illegal to remove Windows from any of the school's computers and he then excused himself from the room." that is just sick and is only thinking of himself and not the children. |
| Ridcully Apr 06, 2011 4:48 AM EDT |
For Jsusanka...........I assume the Director was in Queensland Australia ? That is precisely how Microsoft has this Australian State sewn up (and probably the others as well). As far as I know, the Queensland school IT administrators are forbidden by Education Department regulation to use any software other than Windows based material. And the whole she-bang is controlled by Brisbane head office which almost uses "thought police tactics" to make sure the policy is not infringed. This is "Big Brother" with a vengeance. |
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