Oh yawn! Where have you people been the last ten years?
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 7:34 AM EDT |
Oh yeah, I forgot -- you've been kvetching at Microsoft while your freedom rots away around you. Yo, boys and girls. You think Apple has brought this monstrosity upon us? Really? Riddle me this, Batman: In the United States, how different is Apple from all of the cell-phone providers? For years, people have been trained to get ring-tones, apps, etc from the people who sell them phones -- locked cell phones, I might add. Apple may be taking things to a new level, but not that far removed from what's been happening for some time. Mostly, they've just moved to a platform that looks more like a computer and has gotten your interest. |
| jacog Apr 29, 2010 8:27 AM EDT |
It hurts me deeply to say this... deeply, I tell ya... but dino is correct. |
| bigg Apr 29, 2010 9:00 AM EDT |
While we can debate whether or not Microsoft has a monopoly, anyone dealing with Apple does so purely by choice. Quoting:Apple is an even bigger threat. Not only to free software but to many other freedoms: the freedom to use the platform you want, the freedom to use the applications you want, the freedom to listen to the music you want to. Not really. You have the freedom to not deal with Apple. I don't know a single person who is forced in any way to use anything Apple makes. |
| jdixon Apr 29, 2010 9:38 AM EDT |
Also, Apple isn't the one usually suing and funding lawsuits again Linux companies (the recent HTC lawsuit is the exception which proves the rule) or arguing for government policies which marginalize FOSS. |
| hkwint Apr 29, 2010 10:19 AM EDT |
Quoting:or arguing for government policies which marginalize FOSS. You must be kidding! You know why there's an 'A' in BSA? That's for Apple (Adobe, Avid & AutoDesk). And it's the BSA (without Microsoft, because they did their own reply beyond BSA!) that's lobbying against open standards & open source and pro software-patents: http://ec.europa.eu/internal_market/indprop/docs/comp/replie... So effectively, yes, Apple is lobbying for policies which marginalize FOSS. |
| tuxchick Apr 29, 2010 10:26 AM EDT |
Apple has also been relentless in their attacks on free speech, shutting down parody and fan sites, and attacking journalists who publish anything they don't like. Like siccing their tame police force on Jason Chen just a few days ago. |
| jdixon Apr 29, 2010 10:35 AM EDT |
> You know why there's an 'A' in BSA? That's for Apple... That's an exaggeration. Yes, Apple is a member of the BSA. So are Dell, HP, and IBM ([url=http://www.bsa.org/country/BSA and Members/Our Members.aspx]http://www.bsa.org/country/BSA and Members/Our Members.aspx[/url]). And I don't think the BSA funded SCO's lawsuits. > Apple has also been relentless in their attacks on free speech... Yep. But those aren't attacks on FOSS as such. With respect to freedom in general, Apple is far worse than Microsoft. With respect to FOSS, that's not the case. |
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 11:11 AM EDT |
>With respect to FOSS, that's not the case. I'm sorry, but that's not true. FOSS relies on a subset of the freedom surrounding speech, property, etc. FOSS does not live in a vacuum. Anything that diminishes those freedoms further constrains the environment in which FOSS lives, and makes acceptable that which would have been unthinkable. |
| jdixon Apr 29, 2010 12:31 PM EDT |
> I'm sorry, but that's not true. FOSS relies on a subset of the freedom surrounding speech, property, etc. While that's true, Apple's attacks (with the exception of HTC) aren't aimed directly at FOSS. Microsoft's are. Thus, Microsoft is the more immediate and severe threat. I'm not arguing that Apple's actions are a good thing, merely that their threat to FOSS (and freedom in general) is more long term. And Apple's influence is constrained by their market share and relatively high price for their products. They're far more susceptible to market forces than Microsoft is. Unless people want to argue that Apple has a monopoly in "cool and hip electronic devices", of course. I'd like to see the look on the judge's face when that was argued in court. |
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 1:06 PM EDT |
Apple's influence, thanks to iPods, iPhones, and the new iPads is huge. |
| TxtEdMacs Apr 29, 2010 1:33 PM EDT |
Ok, I suggest we canvass those bastions of freedom ... the cell phone oligarchy and the music business to finance our attack on Apple. That should provide some change to hire lawyers and aids to initiate our case. However, I strongly suggest we use most of the funds collected for parties and assorted debauchery, so at the end we can at least say honestly we enjoyed our pursuit of Justice and the American Way*. YBT * Superman, where are you when we really need you? |
| Scott_Ruecker Apr 29, 2010 5:20 PM EDT |
Quoting:FOSS does not live in a vacuum. Anything that diminishes those freedoms further constrains the environment in which FOSS lives, and makes acceptable that which would have been unthinkable. Here I am still wincing from dino's correctness at the top of the thread and here he goes and says something else I totally agree with..;-) Rock on Dino.. |
| TxtEdMacs Apr 29, 2010 5:36 PM EDT |
Quoting:Here I am still wincing from dino's correctness at the top of the thread and here he goes and says something else I totally agree with..You noticed that too. I have been questioning my sanity lately due to that phenomena, but since I am no longer alone I may be slightly less crazy than I thought. YBT |
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 5:43 PM EDT |
Scott and Txt -- Relax and take in a few deep breaths. The phenomenon you are experiencing is nothing more and nothing less than personal growth and intellectual awakening. It's a good thing. Just remember -- Dino's not always right, at least not in the long run. One of these days, I'm sure to make a mistake. Seriously, it's bound to happen. One of these days. |
| caitlyn Apr 29, 2010 5:50 PM EDT |
Quoting:Here I am still wincing from dino's correctness at the top of the thread and here he goes and says something else I totally agree with..;-) I never thought I'd say this when it came to agreeing with dino, but... yeah, me too. In the words of the cow from The Restaurant at the End of the Universe, I think I'll just nip off and shoot myself. |
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 6:26 PM EDT |
caitlyn - If it helps, you can think of me as a broken clock. |
| tuxchick Apr 29, 2010 6:29 PM EDT |
A broken digital clock displays a blank screen. No deep meaning there, just an observation. |
| TxtEdMacs Apr 29, 2010 6:32 PM EDT |
Quoting:Just remember -- Dino's not always right, [...]But that's the problem, I could be nearly certain if dino was for it - it had to be wrong. Now i am agreeing with him/her/it* and I wondering if I have lost my moorings seeping towards the wrong side in the Star Wars sense**. I am at a loss, adrift in dino doubts. Sad. YBT * I know d@mn well it is a him, but have to be P.C. about it. ** But it never made any sense to me. |
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 6:34 PM EDT |
Use the Farce, kook. |
| TxtEdMacs Apr 29, 2010 6:44 PM EDT |
dino, Where have you been? Anyway, glad you are back! YBT |
| dinotrac Apr 29, 2010 6:48 PM EDT |
Txt -- Been busy trying to get my act together in hopes of scaring up a little work. Now that I've given up, I can come back. |
| gus3 Apr 29, 2010 9:15 PM EDT |
Quoting:A broken digital clock displays a blank screen.response 1: Does that mean it has achieved Enlightenment? response 2: Or it displays 18:88. |
| jsusanka May 01, 2010 12:41 PM EDT |
"Oh yeah, I forgot -- you've been kvetching at Microsoft while your freedom rots away around you. Yo, boys and girls. You think Apple has brought this monstrosity upon us? Really? Riddle me this, Batman: In the United States, how different is Apple from all of the cell-phone providers? For years, people have been trained to get ring-tones, apps, etc from the people who sell them phones -- locked cell phones, I might add. Apple may be taking things to a new level, but not that far removed from what's been happening for some time. Mostly, they've just moved to a platform that looks more like a computer and has gotten your interest." totally agree dino - the cell phone industry just plain sucks and it will get worse. you cannot do anything with your phone and the telecommunication providers will see that you don't. On another note I think there really needs to be some health investigations into cell phones and what they can do to people. I have seen some dam powerful phones that I don't think I want by my brain. I guarantee some of these phone cannot be good for your brain. |
| dinotrac May 01, 2010 12:55 PM EDT |
jsusanka - Don't worry about the health aspects. I have -- Hey! What was that? -- cell fones two, and (Will somebody stop ringing that stupid bell?) not never...wat was I saing? Oh yeah -- Who!! is that little guy green? no hurt brane. |
| Bob_Robertson May 02, 2010 4:38 PM EDT |
"...and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." The US was accustomed to having a monopoly phone provider. When long distance was "re-regulated", the local monopoly providers were left in place. So again, US residents continued to be accustomed to a monopoly phone service provider. Now cell phone providers, cable providers, POTS providers, all generally have a monopoly grant to operate in any given area. There are reciprocal agreements in place, so that my Virgin phone can connect through AT&Ts towers, but they don't all do that everywhere either. Most, I would argue the vast majority of, Americans are not even aware that it's possible to get cell phones that are not locked to a particular service provider, and it has never occurred to them to question it because they have no frame of reference to even imagine it. |
| dinotrac May 02, 2010 7:36 PM EDT |
Bob_R.... My family is big on unlocked phones, though they are a little more trouble to find and (initially) more expensive. Right now, my phone puts up an AT&T splash screen on my T Mobile service. Gotta love it. |
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