'Microsoft controls 90% of computers around the world.'
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| tuxchick Jun 21, 2009 4:04 PM EDT |
'Microsoft controls 90% of computers around the world' is completely untrue. As much as I love a good expose of one of the dirtiest companies on earth, it would be better if they got their numbers right. |
| hkwint Jun 21, 2009 4:13 PM EDT |
Not necessarily numbers, one could also argue for a better description. Something like 'Desktop PC's in the first world' instead of just 'computers' or something; I cannot imagine Apple-marketshare being 9% in Niger. And 'control' could also be debated. |
| phsolide Jun 21, 2009 5:14 PM EDT |
As far as "control" goes: [url=http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=_NSAKEY&btnG=Google Search]http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=_NSAKEY&btnG=Google Sea...[/url] |
| Bob_Robertson Jun 21, 2009 6:45 PM EDT |
_NSAKEY Hahahaha, yes, I remember that. And Verasign, run by a former head of the NSA, takes control of the DNS root servers. By Cromm, those were interesting times. Simply having the backbone providers mirror every packet into Ft. Mead seems like chicken feed compared to what they have already done. |
| caitlyn Jun 21, 2009 11:44 PM EDT |
"Microsoft controls 90% of computers around the world" is false but it's the type of market share numbers and hype we've seen around MS before. It's like their claim to 94% of the netbook market, or the oft repeated claim that Linux only has 1% of the desktop. I guess they believe that if a lie is repeated enough times it's true. Some reporters believe that if they read it once in a trade publication or online it has to be true as well. Due dillegence be d@mned... That takes time and effort and doesn't suit any agenda. Let's assume this blogger is sincerely trying to promote Linux. That means they are either misinformed or are using scare tactics. Either way it's bad news. Did anyone notice the comment claiming that the real number should be 96%? I've posted a comment debunking these numbers. Let's see if it gets approved. |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 1:16 AM EDT |
Microsoft may be able to control both computers and their users , if they have paid a license fee.
Since Microsoft themselves guess that 65% is pirated, and thus have no control whats-o-ever, the real title of this piece should be " MS controls nearly 50% of the market " Also, there is still a difference between " market share " ( in the legal sense ) and "market or total market" Since " market share " means that the computers are legally serviceable and legally upgradable, pirated versions ( 65% of the market ) do officially not fall under " market share" , but they do fall under " market ". All of the above is agreed to by one of my students who is a lawyer So, in my opinion MS has 90% plus of the market, but only controls 50% ( or so ) What's your take |
| Sander_Marechal Jun 22, 2009 3:00 AM EDT |
Well, since most pirated Windows installs still install Windows updates, I think Microsoft controls them too. PS: Here's the Microsoft slide on marketshare. It sees unlicenced Windows at about 25%: http://www.osnews.com/story/21035/Ballmer_Linux_Bigger_Compe... |
| tracyanne Jun 22, 2009 4:01 AM EDT |
I think the point is that it's a Microsoft monoculture, and that is what is stifling innovation and competition, it's irrelevant if the OS is a pirated copy of Windows or a legal copy. No one else has a serious chance to compete. For example I've yet again run into the problem of whether or not I can source hardware that actually supports Linux, even though Pioneer Computers advertise that you can buy their computers with Linux pre-installed, as they won't guarantee that any particular hardware configuration will actually work with Linux ("but they work fine with Windows", I'm told). because of the Windows monoculture. no one goes out of their way to ensure that their hardware will work with anything other than Windows. |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 5:41 AM EDT |
.......Well, since most pirated Windows installs still install Windows updates, I think Microsoft controls them too. >>>>>>>>>don't ask questions, just believe me. I live among them All pirated XP comes with all connections to MS disabled by default . This is MS firewall. MS automated updates MS Remote MS sys restore The whole of Thailand is getting it like this from the same supplier. XP pirated copies for the rest of Asia are configured same, according to Mr X. Even the serial number is embedded for your convenience. Piracy is here around 80 to 90 % is this part of the world. Mr Balmer's chart of " only " 25 percent is doctored to make them look good. I really wished I could remember where, but I am sure they had released a "review"( can't remember the correct word ) where MS stated it was 65 %. It's about 2 years ago, I think >>That is, unless I got very real dreams |
| tracyanne Jun 22, 2009 8:18 AM EDT |
Pretty much one hopes that if enough people pirate Windows perhaps it will drive Microsoft bankrupt. |
| Bob_Robertson Jun 22, 2009 8:18 AM EDT |
> All pirated XP comes with all connections to MS disabled by default . Fascinating. So not just "pirated", but hacked as well. I'm impressed. It would solve the problem of having updates get tracked. I wonder why the BSA hasn't been called in yet? |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 8:22 AM EDT |
http://www.physorg.com/news161345972.html Just an interesting article |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 8:29 AM EDT |
I wonder why the BSA hasn't been called in yet? What is the BSA going to do in Asia, if the Law, both police and law makers, are laughing in their face. You didn't think they pay for a license, I hope ! |
| tracyanne Jun 22, 2009 8:34 AM EDT |
I don't see how Windows can have high rates of piracy, every computer has Windows on them at the wholesalers (who tell me that's how they are supplied by the manufacturers), so how is it possible to have a computer purchased retail that doesn't have a legal copy of Windows on it. |
| bigg Jun 22, 2009 8:34 AM EDT |
Who are the 'drug dealers' that get users in these countries addicted to Windows in the first place? Is it the schools? Given the free alternatives, I don't understand why anyone would bother with pirating XP. |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 8:54 AM EDT |
tracyanne
Let me educate you a bit, as I see that as far as this matter is concerned, you are living on a totally other planet. I am writing you from Thailand. About 4 years ago, on request of a student of mine, I went with him to buy a computer . ( just for the techinical side of things ) We discussed what he wanted//needed, including a printer and a monitor. His price was 34.000 Bath, including XP pro preloaded. That was accidently 4000 baht more than his father gave him. So ( short version of the story ) the sales man took out the hard drive, went to the shop next door, bought the same hard drive clean, and installed it. Then...TaTaaaaa...he installed a pirated version of XP. All in view of every body in clear daylight. Every body happy. he got 4000Baht off, which is a little over $100 at this very moment From my teacher friends in Vietnam, I am told that Windows XP piracy is about 98 %. A friend in Indonesia thinks it's about the same there. Please understand it is another culture. Theft in the US is serious Theft here around is only a little bad ( slap on the fingers, a little bla bla bla, etc ) Another friend who is a public prosecutor told me that he actually hadn't heard about a software case in the last 10 years Secondly, here at present moment, you can buy any computer without an operating system installed in almost every shop. As far as I know, that is so for years already. Of course, XP installed or Linux installed is also an option. I go window-shopping regular , whilst my wife is doing the grocery shopping, hairdo etc Trust me, any computer you see, you can get without XP if you insist I bought mine just 5 months ago -Acer Aspire M |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 9:02 AM EDT |
Bigg Some schools have an agreement with and hefty discounts from MS. You maybe can take the hefty monthly school fees as a guide here The most, and just my personal experience coming from working in schools, have a license for the office, and not for the other 200 computers on their grounds. I personally know Big Businesses who work so. The inspector ( yes, they have ) never gets any further than the front office. This was told to me by " one " of them. :-) Talking about Linux is the quickest way to get told that it is Lunchtime, and if you can come back later , please ! :-) |
| tracyanne Jun 22, 2009 9:17 AM EDT |
@nikkels PM me. |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 9:49 AM EDT |
@traceyanne I did |
| krisum Jun 22, 2009 12:29 PM EDT |
Also most people in these parts of the world buy assembled computers rather than the branded ones since they turn out to be cheaper even with higher specs. The retailer installs a pirated version of XP (XP professional here) on such machines and also willingly provides a copy of the pirated CD for future reinstalls. |
| nikkels Jun 22, 2009 8:55 PM EDT |
Also most people in these parts of the world buy assembled computers rather than the branded ones since they turn out to be cheaper even with higher specs. You are very right on that one I think. >>and also willingly provides a copy of the pirated CD for future reinstalls. I doubt it. They refer you to the shop next door, who's business it is to sell pirated stuff. Kind of " brother helps sister " business. The shops are very big, with at least a 1000 different softwares. One CD goes for 150 Baht. ( 120 if you are a regular ) . (( one $ being 35 Baht )) Custom made CDs go for double the price. |
| caitlyn Jun 22, 2009 9:40 PM EDT |
I notice my comment wasn't approved. I guess questioning his 90% number (unless you inflate it further) or pointing out that Linux has more market share was unwelcome. |
| nikkels Jun 23, 2009 12:20 AM EDT |
>>>>>>>>>I notice my comment wasn't approved caitlyn, I am not aware about comments needing approvement. I think it was a software glitch. Try again |
| caitlyn Jun 23, 2009 2:09 AM EDT |
When I entered my comment it clearly stated that it was being held for moderator approval. Sorry, this wasn't a glitch. It was a choice. |
| tracyanne Jun 23, 2009 2:12 AM EDT |
there is one there that sounds like you caitlyn it's annonymous though |
| caitlyn Jun 23, 2009 2:16 AM EDT |
ta: It's not mine. My post quoted IDC and ABI Research figures to show that his 90% number was way off base. |
| nikkels Jun 23, 2009 2:34 AM EDT |
would be nice if we could see that post |
| hkwint Jun 23, 2009 10:17 AM EDT |
In the meantime - while people are searching for Caitlyn's post - please let me ask the following question: Nikkels tells us that almost all personal computers can be bought without OS in countries such as Taiwan, Vietnam and Indonesia. Even 'brand' computers such as Acer Aspire M. There's at least a small demand for those computers where I live (NL, EU, but probably this goes for whole 'First World'), but no offer. I also understand you receive a discount if you buy without legal software. What I'm eager to find out, is: If you shipped those software-less computers from Taiwan to the EU or North America, would those still be cheaper than the same computer 'with the legal software we don't want to pay for'? Are there any websites from those shops in Taiwan where you could compare prices and such? Or are sales just on the street and not on the net? |
| nikkels Jun 23, 2009 10:34 AM EDT |
I don't know, but I am prepared to gather information when I am there around. Next thing I am thinking about ....are those computers really assembled // shipped in Taiwan or are parts shipped from Taiwan and then locally assembled in their warehouse. What made me thinking like this, is that my computer carries a 3 month factory guarantee ( found on the internet ), but I get a 1 year dealer guarantee here. Usually the dealer doesn't give more than the factory, isn't it ? sorry , that's it for now. Can't see my keyboard properly. Night all |
| Bob_Robertson Jun 23, 2009 10:53 AM EDT |
HK, have you looked in the ebay "shops"? On the other hand, it's quite possible that there are OEM and reseller contracts by which Microsoft stops "brand" computer from being sold in the US and EU without Windows pre-installed. |
| krisum Jun 23, 2009 11:03 AM EDT |
When I went in to buy a computer about three years back, then got it built on the spot. So selected a tower cabinet, then an intel motherboard, then a seagate HD (actually just transferred the HD from my old computer) and a LG DVD drive. The assembling was done in a few minutes before my eyes and that was it. I guess this should be possible in other parts of the world too. When I was studying in a university in the US, then had got a second-hand computer that had been assembled by a student. |
| Sander_Marechal Jun 23, 2009 7:30 PM EDT |
Quoting:What I'm eager to find out, is: If you shipped those software-less computers from Taiwan to the EU or North America, would those still be cheaper than the same computer 'with the legal software we don't want to pay for'? Problem: That's classified as "grey import" or "parallel import". You'd risk getting your butt sued off. |
| jdixon Jun 23, 2009 7:56 PM EDT |
> That's classified as "grey import" or "parallel import". You'd risk getting your butt sued off. As a business, possibly. As an individual buyer almost certainly not. |
| Sander_Marechal Jun 23, 2009 8:08 PM EDT |
You're right. But as an individual, would you really want to order a computer from the other side of the world from a company that probably doesn't even speak your language? I mean, it's not like you can go to the Taiwan Acer website and order a laptop. You'd have to deal with Taiwanese resellers. The people that nikkels buys computers from at his local computer shop. And don't forget about import taxes. That may make the imported machine more expensive after all. |
| tracyanne Jun 23, 2009 8:12 PM EDT |
Quoting:And don't forget about import taxes. That may make the imported machine more expensive after all. And therein lies the rub |
| jdixon Jun 23, 2009 8:29 PM EDT |
> But as an individual, would you really want to order a computer from the other side of the world from a company that probably doesn't even speak your language? Believe me Sander, for most people that depends entirely on the price. |
| tracyanne Jun 23, 2009 10:25 PM EDT |
I have to share this, even though it's bit off topic. We received a phone call this morning from Microsoft. Apparently the boss purchased a new MSDN subscription as part of a Microsoft "Open" License agreement. However during the ordering process the new MSDN subscription became associated with an existing "Open" Licence authorisation number, which is due to expire on June 30, which means the new MSDN subscription for the "Open" License will expire at the same time, and the 2 years of "Benefits" to this organisation will be lost. Don't you just love proprietary software. In the course of our conversation I told the Microsoft representative that the only time I use Microsoft products was when I'm working for this company, the rest of the time I use Free Open Source Software, and that I thought this whole debacle was considerably amusing, given that I never have to bother with "Open" License agreements or Authorisation numbers or registration keys. |
| Bob_Robertson Jun 24, 2009 9:16 AM EDT |
> I told the Microsoft representative that the only time I use Microsoft products was when I'm working for this company, the rest of the time... It would not have surprised me if the rep said, "Yeah, me too." But I'm sure when his supervisor heard that on the transcript, he would have been fired. |
| hkwint Jun 24, 2009 11:34 AM EDT |
Quoting:On the other hand, it's quite possible that there are OEM and reseller contracts by which Microsoft stops "brand" computer from being sold in the US and EU without Windows pre-installed. Indeed, that's the main problem. It could be stopped by finding those Microsoft/OEM contracts and sending them to the EC, but those contracts are well hidden and secret. Probably not going to happen anytime soon. An 'easier' way would be to circumvent those reseller contracts by importing those machines from another country was my initial thought. Especially when you 'buy together', like 100 pieces or so, you can divide the shipping & administrative costs. At least I hoped. Quoting:That's classified as "grey import" or "parallel import". You'd risk getting your butt sued off.Didn't know. A real shame. Quoting:And don't forget about import taxes.19%, I know. Quoting:would you really want to order a computer from the other side of the world from a company that probably doesn't even speak your language? Another problem. Unless you have local contacts or so. And the other big problem I thought about is guarantee. You have to buy 105 netbooks if you want to sell 100 of them, was another thought of mine. Not to mention I'm unemployed and don't have money to buy those 105 netbooks in first place, but that can be circumvented by means of crowdsourcing in the 'buy it together'-way. But all of those barriers above are probably the reason why netbooks without OS / with Linux on a big scale is not happening in the country where I live. The result is Microsoft still controls the OEM/distribution channels. |
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