Darn good question, has no good answer.
|
| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| phsolide May 21, 2009 8:47 AM EDT |
Why aren't people running Apache, instead running IIS? It's a really, really good question, but it has no good answer. The answers given will come down to rationalizing what everyone knows is a bad, bad decision, and will sound a lot like how people rationalize staying in abusive relationships. Some small percentage will give answers relating to "business decisions", which managers cite to get dissent to stop, but really mean "my golfing buddy recommended it." |
| number6x May 21, 2009 9:21 AM EDT |
" Why are you not running Apache? New IIS holes should make you rething your web server" I'm not sure I want to re-thing my web server. It sounds like it might even be illegal in some jurisdictions to 'thing' your webserver in the first place. I'll just keep on pinging my web servers, thank you very much! |
| caitlyn May 21, 2009 9:25 AM EDT |
The decision is often political or else made by non-technical people. A close friend of mine works for the state government here. They are going Microsoft everywhere, eliminating both Novell Netware and whatever little Linux they have. The decision was made for political reasons by non-technical people over the objections of IT. |
| jsusanka May 21, 2009 10:33 AM EDT |
"The decision is often political or else made by non-technical people. A close friend of mine works for the state government here. They are going Microsoft everywhere, eliminating both Novell Netware and whatever little Linux they have. The decision was made for political reasons by non-technical people over the objections of IT." yup that is the case where I work. I know our vp's fell in love with share point and live meeting. microsoft bought the livemeeting technology that used to work with any os but now you need active x that only works with ie6. go figure - I thought they were changing their ways. sharepoint is nothing but a content management system that has nothing that plone or drupal doesn't deliver. but hey the vp's like it and that is what is important. and it has all that integration with the desktop that locks us into microsoft for years to come. sweet. |
| rijelkentaurus May 21, 2009 10:53 AM EDT |
Quoting: A close friend of mine works for the state government here. They are going Microsoft everywhere Given that this is Red Hat territory, someone should make political hay out of them sending money to Redmond, Washington as opposed to Raleigh, North Carolina. |
| tuxchick May 21, 2009 11:04 AM EDT |
number6x, I think a good rule is 'consenting adults in the privacy of their homes.' So as long as you are discreet no one will care. |
| Steven_Rosenber May 21, 2009 11:26 AM EDT |
The few times I've managed an Apache box, I kept it simple, but I wonder if some promotion of Apache along with a GUI management tool would bring over more of the Windows crowd. I don't see a whole lot of Apache how-tos out there. They're probably out there. I just haven't seen them. I know it's a badge of geekly honor to do everything in the configuration with the text files (and after six months in OpenBSD, I've done more than my share of text-file hackery), but perhaps there's an easier way. I do seem to remember using a browser-based config tool that controlled Apache and maybe MySQL, too, but it was so confusing, I just went back to the text files. |
| tuxchick May 21, 2009 12:29 PM EDT |
Steven, there are billions of great Apache howtos and books. Maybe even squintillions, including wads of copy-n-paste recipes. Me, I think if a system administrator doesn't want to invest in becoming very competent with servers then they shouldn't be running servers. The Internet has been all but destroyed by incompetent windows software and admins, and the classic windows mentality that you can randomly point-and-click your way into any task, no knowledge required. These days it's a lot more complex because no one is running simple HTTP servers, but big complicated content management systems with all kinds of scripting, load-balancing, and fancy-schmancy third-party servers. With a correspondingly greater number of potential security holes and problems. |
| Steven_Rosenber May 21, 2009 1:23 PM EDT |
Tuxchick, you're right. People who know way more than me run the servers I work on. I really like "The Apache Cookbook" from O'Reilly, but running an Apache server is definitely not something to be taken lightly. I guess not actually running a production server has made be blissfully unaware of all the tutorials out there. I've done a few Intranet-type servers, that's about it. |
| caitlyn May 21, 2009 3:31 PM EDT |
IIS is graphical and easy to setup at the most basic level. It's certainly easier than Apache particularly to people who are intimidated by the command line. In many ways it's a toy for people who aren't web professionals. It's the web server for people who use Front Page to build their websites. Microsoft is banking on people using IIS who just don't understand its flaws and just want something easy to use to throw up a quick and dirty website. It *is* used by professionals in shops where management (often point headed and non-technical) has decided to be a MIcrosoft shop through and through. |
| tracyanne May 21, 2009 5:46 PM EDT |
Quoting:It *is* used by professionals in shops where management (often point headed and non-technical) has decided to be a MIcrosoft shop through and through. I wouldn't call my boss pointy headed, and I wouldn't call him non technical. I would call him someone who grew into his technical career, like many other programmers of his age, and general location, using Microsoft software. He neither has the understanding that there really is something better, nor the will to try something better - because better is different. He is like so many trapped in a cycle of Microsoft dependency. That dependency is hard to break out of. I speak here from experience. No caitlyn, those decisions are not made by pointy haired bosses, they are more often sold to pointy haired bosses, by technical people who believe that Microsoft's products are the only choice, see http://www.computerworlduk.com/community/blogs/index.cfm?ent... the Prisoners Delimma. |
| tracyanne May 21, 2009 5:49 PM EDT |
The question this begs is "how does one go about reversing that dependency?" and in such a way that it is seen as easy to move to the better choice. |
| tracyanne May 21, 2009 5:49 PM EDT |
One way is to make things like Apache administration, at the basic level very very easy, IE a GUI. |
| caitlyn May 21, 2009 6:39 PM EDT |
tracyanne: The scenario you describe with your boss is very common. So is the one I described. In another thread I mentioned a close friend who works for a department of our state government. They are going Microsoft everywhere, pushing out Novell and what little Linux they had, because of decisions made by politicians and non-technical managers over the objections of IT. It isn't an either-or scenario. Both are real and both are unfortunate. |
| chalbersma May 22, 2009 2:26 AM EDT |
As for an Apache GUI interface. What about Apache + GUI? It seems to work well. I think it's just that some people are too lazy to figure out what works best. |
| tracyanne May 22, 2009 4:54 AM EDT |
Quoting:I think it's just that some people are too lazy to figure out what works best. Or maybe too busy putting food on the table with their current skill set, to change direction and learn a new skill set. |
| caitlyn May 22, 2009 7:33 PM EDT |
Or simply choose popular sources of information that are flawed or biased and give them an incorrect perception about Linux, Windows, etc... chalbersma, tracyanne: I don't think there is any one model or one explanation about why people make bad technical decisions like this. It's rather a confluence of many different ways of reaching faulty conclusions. |
Posting in this forum is limited to members of the group: [ForumMods, SITEADMINS, MEMBERS.]
Becoming a member of LXer is easy and free. Join Us!