Freedom, He gets it.
|
| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| azerthoth Aug 25, 2007 6:14 PM EDT |
Took me a few reads of this to really squeeze this into the brick mounted above my shoulders. Lots of us, even as Linux users have accepted our own personal padded cell for our OS. Be it Windows, Linux, BSD, what have you, there is still a jail cell for us. If we look hard enough to recognize it as such at all that is. So the question is then "Whats in your jail cell?" |
| gus3 Aug 25, 2007 8:43 PM EDT |
I'll adjust your metaphor a bit. With Windows and OS X, your choices are "this padded cell, eight feet by ten, painted with nature scenes, or that padded cell, ten feet by eight, painted with oceanic scenes..." etc. The cells vary in size and style, maybe with different furniture, but it's still "choose your padded cell." With Linux, BSD, Syllable, [other freedom-OS's here], you get to cut out your doorway, punch through your Windows ;-) put the exercise equipment down the hall, rebuild the whole thing out of recycled aluminum cans or steel-reinforced concrete, what have you, and the WinOSX Genuine Product Disadvantage jailer never comes by to make sure you're "behaving." Maybe it's a padded cell, but I'm free to re-build it and staff it to my own wishes any time I want. |
| npan Aug 25, 2007 9:41 PM EDT |
> Lots of us, even as Linux users have accepted our own personal padded cell for our OS. How do you connect using Linux to being captive in imprisonment? The point of free software is four specific liberties that a user should have with relation to that program - the right to use, improve, share and publish improvement to the program. Non-free software is a metaphorical jail because the user becomes dependant upon the author of the software to improve that software or requires the author's permission to share the software with another user. So I don't understand why Linux is like a prisoner's cell because Linux is free software. |
| azerthoth Aug 25, 2007 10:00 PM EDT |
npan, I realize that when I try and explain my views I have a severe disadvantage in being a free thinker and I'm typically as subtle as a turd in the pool. Ask yourself this, am I restricted in ANY way with my current set up? There aren't any 'yes, but ...' answers here. You get freedom through restrictions the same way that you get peace through superior firepower. I'm not saying we dont have a nice jail cell, or as gus put it, the ability to change it around a bit to make it even nicer when I want. I'm pointing out that I realize no matter how nice, in its current structure its still a cell. |
| gus3 Aug 25, 2007 10:40 PM EDT |
The room in which I sit while typing this seems to fall under your definition of "cell." But would I do without this "cell"? No, I in fact like having a roof over my head to keep out the rain and wind and snow. By the same token, without the "cell" provided by my chosen OS, I'd be stuck programming in the pre-System/360 style: directly to the hardware, with no guards against my own stupid mistakes. |
| npan Aug 25, 2007 10:44 PM EDT |
> ... I'm pointing out that I realize no matter how nice, in its current structure its still a cell. I am guessing that you are equating lack of functionality with being in captivity. I say that functionally inferior free software is still superior to functionally superior to non-free software. Why is this? Users of free software have the liberty to improve the software whenever the need arises. Users of non-free software need permission to improve the software. Computer programs are made up of a series of instructions that are designed to solve all sorts of problems. If the computer program fails to work as a user requires, then it is the program that needs to be changed to fit the user requirement(s). The computer code is not going to change itself to fit user requirements - it requires a person that understands how to work with computer code. So if the user is unable to speak computer talk, the user should obtain the service of a computer programmer. If a user is living with free software that doesn't meet their requirements, it is usually because they don't want to invest in it. The code is not going to change itself. It requires a person to make the changes. As a result, the user is only as limited as much as they are willing to invest. If the user invests nothing, nothing will happen. If the user invests little, they will get little in return. If the user invests a fair amount, they should receive a fair return. |
| azerthoth Aug 26, 2007 12:00 AM EDT |
Nice explanation npan, as far as it goes. However no matter how much I pay a programmer, not being one myself, it will do nothing to legalize the use DeCSS in the US, nor will it free up mp3 or wmv. There my friend is your cell. There are limits to the vaunted freedoms, as much as we may disagree, these limitations are called laws. Unlike the added limitations that others would convince you are essential to preservation of freedoms, that logic works so well that the US now has warrantless wiretapping. Allow yourself to get outside the rhetoric and think 'what could I do if I were truly free' for a few minutes. I happen to like the current cell that I have chosen, I am more free than I was. What I am not is without the cell at all. Nor am I arguing that the structure we operate under is really wrong in anyway. Legally we are restricted, and on top of that we have voluntarily accepted additional limitations and restrictions. That my friend, no matter how padded and accessorised with champagne fountains is still a cell. We have accepted a plea bargain, but thats ok because for the most part it works. |
| dinotrac Aug 26, 2007 4:58 AM EDT |
>If a user is living with free software that doesn't meet their requirements, it is usually because they don't want to invest in it. You and Bob should get along fine. However, you won't advance free software very far because the great unwashed hordes (such as myself) are limited in our ability to invest. My programming ability is limited. My ability to hire a programmer even more so. I can file bug reports, but I am at the mercy of those with the skill to fix them. I'm just not good enough to break out of the cell that free software developers create for me. That cell, however, is far better than the Microsoft cell. The free software cell allows me to mix up my jailers. If I don't like SuSE, I can try Ubuntu. If I need a special foundation, I can try the mm floor, etc. Still, I am stuck with what the jailers give me. |
| jacog Aug 26, 2007 5:18 AM EDT |
A couple of years ago I used KDE's bug reporting tool to add something to the wish list. I basically asked if they could make Konquerer's detailed file list view read ID3 tags and give me the ability to have artist and album columns for sorting. 6 months passed and one fine day I got an automatically generated email to say that my request had been completed. I was impressed. |
| dinotrac Aug 26, 2007 5:22 AM EDT |
>I was impressed. It's one of the reasons why I prefer KDE to GNOME. Some decent proportion of KDE developers seem to care about what users want instead of what developers think users should want. |
| Bob_Robertson Aug 26, 2007 11:41 AM EDT |
> You and Bob should get along fine. Eh? I'm just as much a "trapped" user as you are. At the moment, anyway. The only answers to technical problems are technical ones. So I try to submit good bug reports. When I've had some extra money, I've donated to Software in the Public Interest, Debian's "holding company" as it were. The only answers to political problems, like DCSS, MP3 and other legal lock-in, are political ones. So I actively work in the advocacy of political liberty. Indeed the KDE bugtrack system is impressive. Its "vote for this bug" feature is especially interesting. Which reminds me, I want to put a wish-list bug in for DigiKam, so that the default "open new folder" name is today's date, rather than Jan 1 1969. |
| Sander_Marechal Aug 26, 2007 2:14 PM EDT |
Quoting:you won't advance free software very far because the great unwashed hordes (such as myself) are limited in our ability to invest. There is so much a non-programmer can do. * Learn how to write great bug reports. There's a big difference between a bug report and a great bug report. Don't just tell me what the problem is, but do so in detail. Tell me exactly how to reproduce it. More importantly, tell me under what circumstances the bug does not occur. * Learn to test software. You have to be able to write great bug reports to do this. Really testing software is hard and boring work. Testing doesn't mean "trying it and see what works". Testing means trying to find any and every way to break it. This usually involves doing the same thing over and over again with different settings or in just a slightly different way. Keep pushing the limits. Once you find a breaking point you can try all kinds of variations on it to see under which circumstances it will or won't break. * Write and create art. There is so much documentation that needs to be written, proof read, translated, etcetera. There's also a chronic lack of graphic designers. * Marketing, advocacy and fund raising. There are not nearly enough people involved with this, and in general the technical people really suck that this. That's actually one of the big problems for FOSS in general: too many technical people and mot enough non technical folk, like marketers, managers, art people, lawyers and what-not. |
| Bob_Robertson Aug 26, 2007 4:28 PM EDT |
> like marketers, managers, art people, lawyers and what-not. They use Macs. |
| azerthoth Aug 26, 2007 5:15 PM EDT |
Great ad slogan Bob. "Use Linux ... the Yuppies dont" |
| Bob_Robertson Aug 26, 2007 6:02 PM EDT |
While it was said as a joke, the fact is that the yuppies have always had this Mac fetish. It's rare to see anything other than a Mac being used by "professionals" in the movies and TV shows, for instance. Let's see how Stephenson put it... "In retrospect, this was telling me two things about people's relationship to technology. One was that romance and image go a long way towards shaping their opinions. If you doubt it (and if you have a lot of spare time on your hands) just ask anyone who owns a Macintosh and who, on those grounds, imagines him- or herself to be a member of an oppressed minority group." Oh yeah, and my favorite part: "With one exception, that is: Linux, which is right next door, and which is not a business at all. It's a bunch of RVs, yurts, tepees, and geodesic domes set up in a field and organized by consensus. The people who live there are making tanks. These are not old-fashioned, cast-iron Soviet tanks; these are more like the M1 tanks of the U.S. Army, made of space-age materials and jammed with sophisticated technology from one end to the other. But they are better than Army tanks. They've been modified in such a way that they never, ever break down, are light and maneuverable enough to use on ordinary streets, and use no more fuel than a subcompact car. These tanks are being cranked out, on the spot, at a terrific pace, and a vast number of them are lined up along the edge of the road with keys in the ignition. Anyone who wants can simply climb into one and drive it away for free." |
Posting in this forum is limited to members of the group: [ForumMods, SITEADMINS, MEMBERS.]
Becoming a member of LXer is easy and free. Join Us!