Top 10 apps?
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| SFN Jan 20, 2005 10:52 AM EDT |
It's too bad they chose to cover Crossover Office as the implementation of WINE. Crossover Office is a nice program and the Codeweavers people are to be commended but it would have been much handier to Linux users to cover the use of WINE itself. Wine can be a bear. Having said that, I haven't tried JDS so maybe Crossover is integrated tightly into it. As far as the top 10 apps go, Dreamweaver? Office? Photoshop? How about focusing on programs that actually replace (and in some respects) improve upon these programs? Especially OpenOffice, which, you know....Sun...OpenOffice? Hello? And Acrobat? If they mean the reader, how many native ones already exist for Linux?. If they mean Acrobat itself, OpenOffice already converts to PDF. Why would you want to run the Windows version in Linux? |
| cjcox Jan 20, 2005 11:17 AM EDT |
Codeweaver's wine is based of an older version of wine... HOWEVER, with that said, in many, many, many (did I say many?) respects it is vastly superior to other implementations, be it the current cvs wine or cedega. Just something I've noticed. CVS wine is a mixed bag. Let's just say the vintage of the wine can matter much... don't expect an app that ran 3 years ago to run on today's wine (as strange as that might seem). It might work, it might not. You may end up with several wine's from different dates on your system so that you can run your favorite apps. Of course, testing all of the releases over the years will take some time :) Though I can't read Sam's mind, I will say that OOo (or StarOffice for that matter) don't even implement 50% of Microsoft Office today. Granted, most people don't need all of the features, but it does mean that OOo can't TRULY replace Microsoft Office.. not yet (and probably not for a long, long time). With that said, OOo is becoming its own thing... perhaps Microsoft compatability is not something that really should be grasped. I think that's a better strategy anyhow. The top ten apps, again were composed by vote... so you can't argue with that (well some will claim that the vote was rigged by the Republicans). Acrobat... again, has features not present anywhere else. You are right though, most would not need the features... in fact, most bought Acrobat (probably) for the simpler stuff that could easily be done in OOo/ps2pdf/etc... but once you get hooked on the features (even ones you initially didn't want), it's hard to "live" without them. No show stopper... but manager's get tired of hearing, "Well... we used to be able to.... , but now with the new system, we can't....". I used to work for a company where we wrote a full Cobol/CICS engine for Unix. But people didn't want something that was compatible with the mainframe, they wanted THE MAINFRAME. Something that was very hard to deliver. And so it is with Windows software. People won't mind switching to Linux as long as it's exactly like Windows (ugh!). JDS is NOT tightly integrated with Crossover Office. Just fyi. You can get the same effect if not BETTER with Crossover Office on any Linux distribution. |
| tuxme Jan 20, 2005 1:35 PM EDT |
Those top 10 actually aren't the top 10 compatible ones... just the ones that people have tried the most. Office 2003 and Photoshop CS don't work in Crossover office and are untested by Codeweaver... |
| MESMERIC Jan 20, 2005 4:59 PM EDT |
CrossOver Office is ok
just damn damn slow (RAM hungry) and buggy at times (try saving for the web in Photoshop 6 & 7)
It's purpose is for a quick-botch job but not for a replacement
Say you need to do a quick Internet Explorer Sanity test
(remember you won't get VML and Filters working)
Say you need to be 100% sure of what a Word document will look like for a new client.
That sort of stuff - but not for production. You have other alternatives - Win4Lin is my favourite but will only work with Windows 98 (or 95 or ME) .. Corel Draw 11 doesn't run on Wine but it will run on Win4Lin Sadly there is no package as good as Corel Draw for me (or that can open CDR format from clients) Then you have VmWare - if you are cursed in knowing only C# as your web development language you will need that. No other emulator will let you install Visual Studio.NET (yes very depressing) But you'll need a fast PC for that with generous amounts of memory. Lastly you have dual booting .. no never - never - ever . sorry can't What is the difference people will protest. At least with emulators I am still free to do other normal things like reading the email :) |
| maggrand Jan 21, 2005 2:38 PM EDT |
Well the most common question to this would be.
Why do we have to copy or replicate the Windows software. Isn't it better that Linux makes it owns versions and then in a later stage becomes killer apps. Also keep in mind that the Microsoft software and the OS is the most unsecure system that exists for today. And that reason alone is a big reason to switch OS and the APPs. |
| AnonymousCoward Jan 22, 2005 2:47 PM EDT |
cjcox: ooWriter implements a damn sight more than 50% of MS-Word, and will also do mucho stuff that MS-Word doesn't. Ditto for ooImpress and MS-PowerPoint. The only place where OOo sucks WRT MSO is ooCalc vs MS-Excel, and even there ooCalc does some things MS-Excel doesn't. I also expect the relative ooCalc suckiness to quickly evaporate, and a credible replacement for MS-Access to arise. Have you tried any of the OO2 betas? The one component still missing for me is an MS-Publisher import to ooWriter and the corresponding convenience features (stuff like automatically creating a new set of frames when text overflows the last existing frame and linking them in). This too shall pass. |
| PaulFerris Jan 23, 2005 12:21 AM EDT |
Open Office will have its day... Everyone thought the browser wars were done -- they obviously are not (thankfully -- IE was getting rather stale and long in the tooth). The same thing will happen very soon with OO -- I know businesses are constantly eyeing it as a way to reduce cost and even a 10 percent share would be a seizmic event for Microsoft to deal with. |
| cjcox Jan 23, 2005 1:42 PM EDT |
AC: I don't mean to be rude... but there is NO way that OOo implements >50% of MS Office today. As I stated... most people do not NEED the features that are missing, and that is why you BELIEVE it is not true. However, in the corporate world, I'm amazed at the number of obscure features that they CANNOT live without. And so... CrossOver Office has a need... and I'm fine with that. Interestingly, you mentioned an obscure feature yourself that is not implemented. And it's one that frankly I never though of... maybe the percentage of completeness is 40%?? AC: Also, I did NOT mean to imply that the OOo features that are not in MS Office are not important... in fact, I think they are of paramount importance with regards to change. This is why I said that 100% Microsoft compatibility might not be the right goal. OOo is already 100% successful. Most believe it won't be successful until it dominates >50% of the productivity software market... but I'll tell you, that just like Linux, it's successful because it can be chosen... and that's a success story in and of itself. |
| robT Jan 23, 2005 4:33 PM EDT |
cjcox: Perhaps you give some examples. I've worked (mostly as an end-user) in "corporations" for close to 20 years and I've moved to OOo quite easily. |
| PaulFerris Jan 23, 2005 6:20 PM EDT |
cjcox: what we need in OO is the "feature" where it corrects a TLA (Three Letter Acronym) for you over and over again. I love that. For example, try typing "IHS" in Word. It will repeatedly correct it to "HIS", regardless of what you do, till you hunt down the word "his" in some obscure menu setting and remove it from the list. Just what the heck is IHS, anyway? IBM HTTP SERVER -- Apache. There's one way to prevent a corporation from deploying a competing product -- make sure that no supporting documentation can be created! --FeriCyde |
| tuxchick Jan 23, 2005 9:05 PM EDT |
I'm an old MS Office guru and a new Open Office guru, and I don't believe people are making the right comparisons. OO Writer is not warmed-over Ms Office for Linux, it's completely different. Reviewers like to carp about "it doesn't include an email client" and "it doesn't import Office files perfectly." Well shitfahr, no email client? And there is a worldwide shortage going on, what are we going to do. Migration is a larger issue, but at least OO is trying, unlike certain large convicted illegal monopolists. While OO cannot match MS Office for sheer numbers of features, it has a number of advantages: open file formats and it's cross-platform. No more data held hostage to proprietary, closed, incompatible file formats. That alone should be of supreme importance. OO Writer is great. The mistake most folks make is trying to use it like MS Word. You can't- it is very different, and in most ways better than MS Word. Hint: learn to use Styles and the Navigator, and everything else falls into place. The rest of the suite has a way to go for sure. Though I question the need for a PowerPoint clone- good lord, how many more slideshows do we have to suffer through? The horror. And a database with a friendly interface would be wicked cool. Something like Access, only with a completely different look, backend, and works right. Then maybe people will quit using spreadsheets like databases and old grumps like me will quit scolding them for it. Yeah, I know you all already said a lot of this. Well now I'm happy. :) |
| PaulFerris Jan 24, 2005 1:53 AM EDT |
Powerpoint presentations should be banned, IMHO, unless you're a CEO doing a presentation to the board where you need to keep people awake. I heard one time that good old Scott McNeally banned it at Sun and productivity at meetings went up -- don't know if it was FUD or not but I'm a visual kind of guy, and I've taken lately to estimating the actual content in a typical powerpoint presentation -- try it yourself sometime. it's like a ratio of between 20:1 (20 slides to a page of well-written content) to 5:1 -- and usually the thing is used more like a score than a focus point. A good speaker who knows his audience and topic would do well to drop it altogether. I did this recently at Ohio Linux Fest -- went to talk there, was in the midst of making the stupid presentation -- and said "what the heck do I need this for?". I kept eye contact with the audience -- it was worth way more than a presentation. Especially since part of my talk was about the usage of computer equipment in places where it shouldn't be used (meetings and lug events where you need to meet people). |
| cjcox Jan 24, 2005 9:16 AM EDT |
robT: I've never put together a comprehensive list, and I'm not sure what it would prove. I have a feeling that it would prove that ~50% is optimistic... and that's just fuel for the fire to media pundits. The good news is that OOo works for you... and again, that's a success story. Let's say that OOo support 99% (which it doesn't come close of course) of the MS Office feature set. That missing 1% could very well keep it out of the enterprise (strange as that may seem). That's the real point. As I stated, perhaps 100% MS Office compatibility is the wrong goal. I mean... that's a follower's position... not a leader's position. What OOo needs are very useful features that make people want to switch to it (there are already some nice features... but perhaps not too many OMG like features). |
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